Problems with the Trinity?
The Trinity
The Trinity was the last biggie that I took on. This doctrine is so widely accepted that when I saw it challenged, I was surprised. This doctrine teaches that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are all the same entity. Yes, I know that is an oversimplification, but this is the basis of the belief. The problem is that the Bible refers to one God many times. However, the volume of scriptures indicating that Jesus and God are separate beings is overwhelming.
The biggest and most fundamental problem I have with the doctrine of the Trinity is that its ultimate conclusion is that Jesus did not actually die and was not actually resurrected by the Father. If one is to believe that Jesus was immortal at the time of His crucifixion, then He sacrificed nothing and his death and resurrection were merely an act or a facade’. I believe that Jesus voluntarily left the Father, voluntarily became man, and voluntarily gave His life - 100% of it, died for our sins, stayed dead for around 72 hours, and was resurrected by the Father. I find this scenario impossible to reconcile while holding the doctrine of the Trinity.
The first big question I had when examining the Trinity doctrine is borne out of the following scripture and others like it:
Who is he condemning? It is Christ who has died, but rather also who is raised, who is also at the right handof God, who also intercedes for us.
(Romans 8:34)
Christ is at the right hand of God and intercedes for us. One cannot sit at the right hand of oneself.
For God is one, and there is one Mediator between God and man, the Man Christ Jesus,
(1 Timothy2:5)
Jesus is the Mediator between God and man.
And He went a little further and fell on His face, and prayed, saying, O My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me. Yet not as I will, but as You will .
(Matthew 26:39)
Two points I glean from the scripture above:
1) Jesus prays to the Father. He does not pray to Himself.
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2) Apparently the Father’s will is different than the Son’s will.
Sermon Notes: The Father and the Son
All NASB
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
This used to be the most popular scripture in the entire world of Christianity. I can remember watching football games on TV and seeing men in the freezing cold with no shirts on holding up a sign that said, simply, John 3:16.
When I was a kid, I had no clue what that meant. I hadn’t a clue about the numbering of the Bible or even an inkling of the gravity of that verse uttered by the Son of God 1900 some odd years ago. Now that I am a little more educated, a little more mature, and a whole lot more faithful, I see that verse as a summation of a whole lot of the Bible and quite probably the most important verse in the whole book – much like those frozen football fans of days gone by.
But as we all know, just looking at one lonely verse can lead to error. So let’s take a look at the next verse:
"For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
(Joh 3:17)
God sent the Son into the world. This deserves some meditation. Especially in light of what the vast majority of Christianity teaches about who Jesus was/is versus what the WORD tells us of Christ. Jesus, Yeshua of Nazareth, had dwelt in heaven with the Father and was sent into this world. I think it is very, very important to meditate on that. Jesus was sent. The Son was sent. This means that someone else did the sending. Who did the sending? The Father. Wow.
Let’s look back up to verse 16 again.
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
(Joh 3:16)
A point that I think escapes many, many people is that God gave His Son. In order to give something, you must posses it. You must own it. You cannot give what you do not possess. God gave Yeshua to the world. In our modern parlance, God said, “here you go world, here is My beloved”.
Mainstream Christianity teaches something I cannot reconcile about Jesus and God. Yeshua and YHVH. They teach that both are the same. In fact, they teach that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are 3 branches of one God. 3 parts of a whole. Diana called me the other day in disbelief. She caught something on the television around St. Patrick’s day (yep, another made-up holiday) about the 3 leaved clover and how that represents the “Trinity”. The stem being God and the three leaves being the three persons of the Trinity. Yep, one being, but multiple personalities – like Shirlie McClain, but immortal.
But the “three parts of a whole” makes no sense when examining these verses. How can 1/3 of something command another third of the same something to separate and leave? What about the third third? Does it not get a say? I mean, if there are 3 thirds, shouldn’t there be an election on which third gets sent and which two get to say? Does this make any sense at all? Well, not to me, that’s for sure.
In the New Testament of the NASB, the phrase “Son of God” appears 43 times, the phrase “my father” occurs 51 times, the words “Father, Son, and Holy Spirit” occurs twice all together Mat 28:19 and Gal 4:6.
It seems the entire Bible is based on the relationship between the Father and the Son.
Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth."
(Gen 1:26)
For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things have been created through Him and for Him.
(Col 1:13-16)
These two verses tell us a whole lot. Today, I am focusing on one little point, though. Jesus, Yeshua of Nazareth, is the Son of God. Of this, there is no doubt. Genesis says let “us” make man in our image. From Colossians, we know what this image was. Jesus – at least 4000 years prior to His earthly birth – is the image of the Father. He is not the Father, because you cannot be the image of something and be that something at the same time. He is the image of the Father. We know that He was with the Father at creation and indeed, Jesus Christ, is the Creator of the universe. He created all things by the power of God and all things were created for Him.
And, He came down here of His own free will, even though He was sent by the Father. He was sent, and He chose to be sent, and He came down here and sacrificed Himself completely for our sakes.
He wanted to do it. He had free will. He did not have to do it. He prayed “Father, if possible, let this cup pass from me..
Mainstream Christianity appears to have made a very, very big mistake. God has allowed us to know Him by many names throughout the Scriptures. My favorite is Elohim because that is a plural word that is used during the Creation account in the Hebrew in Genesis. But mainstream Christianity has chosen to call God by a name that He never chose. They call him Trinity. But He is not Trinity. That name is never mentioned in the scriptures and I cannot reconcile the concept.
Take a moment and ponder how pompous this is. Would we ever address our employers with a name they did not choose to be called? Certainly not if they were within earshot! Would we ever call a head of State by a title he did not choose? Regardless of your politics, if you had a chance to meet the President of the United States would you dare to address him with a title he did not consent to be called? Of course not. Could you imagine what would happen if someone called a dictator like Hugo Chavez, Mahmoud Ahminedinejad, or Kim Jong Il by some title they just made up? Well, it probably wouldn’t work out so well for the poor soul who made that mistake.
Yet those who choose to be called servants of God, even those who desire to have the titles they chose such as Priest, Bishop, Minister, Pastor, or Reverend will teach their followers that they get to decide the name of our own God. This is preposterous and the opposite of the humility required of a follower of the Elohim of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Jesus.
I studied up on the topic of the Trinity while preparing for this message. What I found is that it’s roots are in the – can you guess it? Yep, council of Nicea. The men who had put themselves in charge of Christianity had a problem – people called Arians were teaching something different than they were about God and Jesus. Dissent and freedom of thought could not be tolerated. So they had to come up with some doctrine and sort of throw down the gauntlet in respect to the relationship between God and Jesus. What they came up with was that Jesus and the Father were of the same “substance”. They did not come up with a Trinity AND they still realized that Jesus and the Father were different – somehow. They left it at that and it took until the end of the 4th century before the Trinity became complete with all three parts. Again, 350 years after Christ.
It was interesting to read some of the material defending the Trinity that even confessed to borrowing from pagan cultures. I recall one quote was that “Christianity converts cultures from within” which means instead of making people leave their old ways behind completely, it has been the habit of Christianity, especially apostolic Christianity, to blend in exiting traditions with Christianity to make the transition easier – this is called syncretism. What is very interesting is that all the pagan religions going back as far as the tower of Babylon have a Trinity. Whether it was Tammuz, Semaramis, and Nimrod or Isis, Horus, and Osiris, or Jupiter, Mars, and Venus – that Trinity was always there. And, as of about 400 AD, the Trinity has been Christianized.
Which brings me to another point. Yeshua, Jesus, was THE MESSIAH! Turn to Daniel 9 verse 25
"So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress.
(Dan 9:25)
The following from Clarke’s commentary, that I just accidentally had my computer set to when I looked up Dan 9:25:
Dan 9:25 -
From the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem - The foregoing events being all accomplished by Jesus Christ, they of course determine the prophecy to him. And if we reckon back four hundred and ninety years, we shall find the time of the going forth of this command.
Most learned men agree that the death of Christ happened at the passover in the month Nisan, in the four thousand seven hundred and forty-sixth year of the Julian period. Four hundred and ninety years, reckoned back from the above year, leads us directly to the month Nisan in the four thousand two hundred and fifty-sixth year of the same period; the very month and year in which Ezra had his commission from Artaxerxes Longimanus, king of Persia, (see Ezr_7:9), to restore and rebuild Jerusalem.
So, here we have yet another popular theologian writing in yet another popular reference tool that Jesus, Yeshua, the Messiah, is the Messiah, not the Father, and He was crucified at Passover, AND that in order for this prophesy to be fulfilled, He HAD to be crucified at Passover. Anyhow, he point being is that Jesus, Yeshua, is the Savior, the Messiah, the Anointed of God, the Son of God…. But is not the Father! Separation is key. Looking further at the word Messiah, we see the New Testament authors use this word to identify Jesus, Yeshua, a whole lot. In Matthew chapter 1, it is used several times, starting with verse one calling Jesus the Messiah, the son of David, the son of Abraham. It’s just crazy that the very first verse of the New Testament makes it clear that Jesus is of Hebrew lineage – a book written decades after His ascension, and that Jesus is not the Father!
But look here in John chapter 1, verse 41
He *found first his own brother Simon and *said to him, "We have found the Messiah" (which translated means Christ).
(Joh 1:41)
They had found the MESSIAH which means Christ which means the anointed one! To them, they are saying “Look, we have found God’s anointed one”. They are not saying “We have found God Himself”. The difference to me is stark, especially in light of how many years passed between the events described in the Gospel according to John and that book actually being penned. Had Jesus actually been the Father, don’t you think that the Gospels would be written differently?
The culmination needs to be that Christ died for our sins…. He really died in the faith that the Father would resurrect Him. Justice demanded resurrection as Jesus was not only innocent of the charges against Him, He was completely innocent of anything! His innocent death that we are about to remember in a few weeks paves the way for our chance at eternal life. He paid the price for us, He really, really died. Look at Hebrews 9:
For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance. For where a covenant is, there must of necessity be the death of the one who made it.
(Heb 9:15-16)
Hebrews 9 is plain, and we can see throughout the scriptures that Jesus and the Father are not one and the same. Jesus is the MEDIATOR. He is between us and the Father. He makes intercession for us. Even in the Book of Acts, chapter 1, after Jesus has been raised and is being questioned by the Apostles, He still refers to God as “the Father” – in the third person!
Our congregation is different than most, though. We do not tell people what to believe. This is part of the freedom we have in Christ. Even when churches do tell people what to believe and appear to force that belief on their followers, it is no guarantee that they really believe it. You see, the freedom we have in Christ is that we all must come to our own conclusions about matters of doctrine and faith.
So, no matter how each of us reconciles the relationship between the Son and the Father, it cannot contradict the scriptures, especially that the Son died for our sins. This death, voluntary and unwarranted, allows us to come to Jesus, declare our love and gratitude for the gift of grace, confess our sins, and be adopted children of God. Christ’s atoning sacrifice has made us free. No amount of taunting or persecution can take that away. God watched as His Son was murdered. Jesus voluntarily gave His life for the redemption of sins. He has set us free, thanks be to God! Let us enjoy our freedom and use it wisely.
